Before I begin, let’s get a couple of things straight:
- It can be safely assumed you are a passionate and articulate fan of rock ‘n roll if you’re here in the Hall.
- It can be safely assumed that you are aware of the gulf between The Rolling Stones’ “Honky Tonk Woman” and any song by AC/DC.
- Any possible comparisons between Bon Scott and Brian Johnston will not be considered relevant to the discussion.
OK. So I’ve been listening to AC/DC’s High Voltage over the past week. My friend Seth bought me a couple of AC/DC albums last year as both fine birthday gifts and educational opportunities. He wanted me to hear their albums’ productions and see if there was anything I could learn and better understand when he discussed the sound of our own band’s productions. Since receiving these educational gifts, I listen to these albums every few months. I see what he means about the awesome dry production of the drums and guitars, in particular. It’s the kind of production lovers of dry recording get wet over. Listen to the intro of the opening track, “It’s a Long Way to the Top (If you Wanna Rock ‘n’ Roll)”, if you want to know what floats my boat in terms of dry production. If possible, hit PAUSE at the 29-second mark, right before the vocals enter.
That’s some fine rock ‘n roll opening, isn’t it? I think it’s on par with the opening to “Honky Tonk Woman”. I especially love the restraint Malcolm Young shows in laying out for the opening measures. Throughout this album he displays a mastery of not playing! When he actually does hit a power chord, it sounds much more powerful than it would have had he hit it right from the start of a section. Kids and old, nobody musicians alike, take note!
Now, resume playing the track, with Bon Scott’s entrance to the song.
When this one’s finished, you might also want to check out the album’s second track, “Rock ‘n’ Roll Singer”. Scott does state his purpose in this song, so maybe it will be helpful in answering my questions.
Before I ask you these few questions, let’s get one more thing clear:
- It should not be expected that AC/DC is in any way an intellectually driven band.
So here’s what I’d like to know from you, the listener:
- What value does Bon Scott bring to the music of AC/DC, to you, the listener?
- Assuming that Bon Scott’s role as reflected in songwriting credits includes the writing of lyrics, are the lyrics part of his value-added package?
- Where do you, the listener, place the intellectual side of yourself when listening to Bon Scott’s work with AC/DC?
- Is Bon Scott a good singer? Does his voice have pleasing qualities to you, the listener, or are you and other AC/DC fans simply getting off on his over-the-top, in-your-face delivery?
- Could the music of AC/DC have been better had they had a singer capable of singing in a less-overt style and providing slightly more interesting lyrics?
I look forward to your comments.
1) His total commitment to the style of the song.
2) I appreciate the humor.
3) At the bottom of a bottle. Will I then throw that bottle? Maybe.
4) No, he’s a nasty, annoying, wretched singer, thankfully, for this nasty, annoying, wretched music that really rocks.
5) I don’t think so. His over-the-topness seems to me absolutely integral to the band.
Mr. Mod asked:
What value does Bon Scott bring to the music of AC/DC, to you, the listener?
Mark’s right on target here. He’s *real*, in a way that few front men are. Since AC/DC are real in a way not many bands are, they made a good match. I really think it’s no small coincidence that the band’s relevance as agent provocateurs vanished with Bon’s departure. If you watch the early stuff on the excellent (Disc one, anyway) “Family Jewels” DVD set, you can *really* see what Bon brought to the band.
There’s another mediocre R&R singer I happen to love: Ronnie Van Zant. He brought a “watch your step, son, or I’ll stomp a mudhole in your ass” vibe to that band, and they needed it, to hoist them out of virtuosic noodle-ry. Bon brought the ass-whup to the table, but leavened it with a sly-dog, leering, roguish charm. I’ve read a couple of books about the guy, and I think the fact that Bon was a serious p*ssy magnet says a lot about what made him great.
Assuming that Bon Scott’s role as reflected in songwriting credits includes the writing of lyrics, are the lyrics part of his value-added package?
See leering, roguish comment above.
Where do you, the listener, place the intellectual side of yourself when listening to Bon Scott’s work with AC/DC?
I see AC/DC as therapy for my Rock mind.
Is Bon Scott a good singer? Does his voice have pleasing qualities to you, the listener, or are you and other AC/DC fans simply getting off on his over-the-top, in-your-face delivery?
Is he a “good singer”? For his band’s requirements, hell yeah! When I credit most anybody with “keepin’ it real,” I’m usually joking. Not so with Bonnie. That unique howl of his is part of the reason why. A “beautiful” voice just wouldn’t work with that band — I know you see that as clearly as I do.
Could the music of AC/DC have been better had they had a singer capable of singing in a less-overt style and providing slightly more interesting lyrics?
No. What a dumb question! >:0@
Incidentally, I have long dreamed about getting the Head in a studio and getting the Vanda/Young AC/DC sound out of you. If you’re serious about undertaking this experiment, I should have a brand-new, kick-ass studio facility in the late spring to do it in (yes, I mean a “real” studio facility — not just an extension of the home studio I’ve been working out of to date). I’m serious. I’ll do it for free — but you have to hand over the keys to let me get that sound down. Just one or two songs is all I ask. I’m serious.
Final pince-nez point: Bon is lying about not knowing how to play the ‘pipes in that clip. He was a fairly accomplished bagpipe player as a child in his native Scotland.
hrrundivbakshi wrote:
Watch it, this gets awfully close to bringing in a comparison to Brian Johnston. We agreed to table that part of the discussion.
So was Brian Jones. It didn’t serve him in the lead singer role.
Doesn’t the adjective “roguish” work a lot better when it’s modifying “charm”? Does Scott bring charm to the equation? I get teh fun, naughty bits, but I don’t hear him upping the ante the way – and I hate to bring this guy into the discussion – David Lee Roth used to do for VH. To say more on this subject right now might require me to break our gentleman’s agreement re: Brian Johnston, so I’ll stop here.
You may be onto something here. His Everyman realness is unique. Nevertheless, I’m not convinced that it doesn’t immediately bring down the opening 29 seconds of “It’s a Long Way to the Top…” As I mentioned last week, I honestly believe AC/DC would have been MUCH better with Steve Marriott belting out slightly less juvenile crap. Marriott could sing of lust as if he’d performed his lustful acts in a bed and not just the backseat of a car or in a closet.
When the time is right, the Head may take you up on your offer. Seth will be ready to lay tracks as soon as you plug everything in. Thanks!
Once again, I solicit the opinions of the TOWNSWOMEN:
Who was more charming, Bon Scott or David Lee Roth?
I look forward to your responses.
Townswomen, at the risk of sounding like your father, you don’t have to answer this question!
Mr. Mod, must I make you see things through the eyes of a mature, sensual being again? Too many of you guys really needed a trip to Tijuana as teens. There’s nothing lacking in what Bon Scott brought to AC/DC! You’re the one who’s lacking. She’s got balls. You don’t!
KingEd/Mr. Mod: I think the *real* problem here is that Moddy has been spending too much time pacing around in his Rock lab coat, studiously puffing on his Jethro Tull Sherlock Holmes pipe.
I mean, explaining why Bon Scott kicked major ass is kind of like explaining why the sight of a peanut-studded turd in a urinal makes us laugh. Well, us guys, anyway. He just did, and it just does!
BTW, TOWNSWOMEN: you *do* have to answer the Bon Scott/DLR question. I don’t know why Mr. Mod is giving you an out here — I suspect it’s because he won’t like what he hears. Tell you what: let’s *really* ruin Jim’s day — add Steve Marriott to the mix. How charming was *he*? What exactly are your feelings on titanium-throated garden gnomes?
I look forward to your responses.
Will will be sorry that you’ve broadened what started out as a Hobson’s Choice. The ladies love titatnium-throated garden gnomes (LLTTGG)!
I believe you’re serious, but I can’t believe you’re serious. Almost all of Marriot’s “hard-rocking” vocals seem unintentionally parodic to me, the worst sort of blooze yelping. Scott brings genuine menace as well as parody, and that makes all the difference.
Oh, good lord! Moderation in all things except a moderator! Just when I was too depressed to even log on and see how many grooves are on side 1 vs. side 2 of that Humble Pie record, our selfless hero walks out in the crisp morning air, places a tee right in the center, dusts a few stray blades of grass from around it, and caps it with this tasty, hilarious confection. I doff my cap, sir! Christ! The peanut-encrusted turd, Fritz? The TTGG? Fucking brilliant. But Jim, let me treat the question seriously for one moment. First, the first song is an incredibly weak one for Mr. Scott. No melody, or even, as he usually has it, hollering shape. It *is* a let down, after that intro, even if you like him. When AC/DC comes on, my ass starts bumping all over the place, so I have to take it down from the shelf where I usually keep it. *That* is where I put my intellectual side until somebody puts the Hindemith back on. But the point to me is that Bon Scott is a perfectly proportioned hood ornament for that truck. When those guitars rip (and self-consciously middle-aged hi-fives to Seth for grokking that production on his hydrogen-gas remastered audiophile graphite lp) in, and every instrument comes in just right, all I ever wish for is that no one will suddenly try to tell me something, or “sing me a song.” He supplies a low-contrast musicality that is almost always more on target than the one you used as example. The holler is growly, but full – and stayed on the edge of bleeding tonsils for his whole carreer. He believes himself to be (as I see it) somewhat of a shitheel, or a loser, but knows how to milk same and doesn’t apologize. Only ever cocky to the extent he seems aware of the noise he makes, but never gazing at his shoes either. I don’t get why you want anything more in an AC/DC song. If you could just hear the rhythm section go, it would get uncomfortable and need something. What to add? Well, the kooky movie version would be that when the bumbling scientist tries to beam himself across the room and the crossed wires accidentally pipe in the intro to that song while his molecules are making noodly sounds in the air -he steps out of the other side, I posit, Bon Scott.
I’m impressed by the passionate and articulate defenses I’ve read of the work of Bon Scott today. Do I wish a Townsman or Townswoman would step forward to say, “You’re right, Mr. Mod. Think how much better AC/DC would have been had they had a singer with a rhythmic and melodic sense – and I don’t mean Brian Johnston, because we have agreed to keep him out of this discussion!” Yes, I wish such a Townsperson would have stepped forward. As it is, I have learned something about the perspectives of Mr. Scott’s fans. It has been helpful. I still wish Steve Marriott had been the singer and lyricist. Even a supreme hack like Chris Robinson might have sealed the deal for me. The hard rock vocal style, with the exception of Robert Plant’s hippie wail, rubs me the wrong way. Bon Scott, in particular, seems like the set up for Jello Biafra. I alwasy wished his voice could have been removed from Dead Kennedys, but some of you have heard this gripe before. I’ll save reopening those wounds for another day.
If all goes well, this will not be the end of this thread. I sense a lot of helpful perspectives have yet to be expressed, and I’m almost sure that at least 2 or 3 Townspeople could shed additional light on my point of view. Keep ’em coming!
When I hear “Highway to Hell,” I get the same chill as when I hear Hank Williams, in that both have honestly embraced a path of self-destruction, without trying to evade or lessen the grim reality (of where this path leads to) through some sort of “theatrical” approach.
Dr. John
Dr. John, you just said a mouthful! Bravo!!
So, if what Dr. John said is a Bravo-worthy mouthful am I to believe that Bon Scott’s value to the band was in killing himself? He’s some kind of martyr for The Power and Glory of Rock ‘n Roll?
I do wish you’d read a bit more carefully, Mr. Mod. To put this in words that you might use: Hank Williams and Bon Scott faced the consequences of their “live fast” lifestyle like MEN, not with the sort of “nudge, nudge, wink, wink” ironic pose that too often accompanies espousals of The Power and Glory of Rock ‘n Roll.
I don’t know, to me Hank was nothing if not adult. Many of his most famous songs are not about new love, but about marital strife. Even though he wasn’t very old chronologically when he died (29), he seems never to have been young.
When I think of ACDC I think of arrested adolescence. Is this because my scant familiarity with their work is mainly version 2 of the band? Did Bon Scott get old before he died without my noticing?
Also we were talking about arrested adolescence the other day in another thread, in that case the Brian Wilson pupppy love syndrome. I know I’m mixing threads here, but maybe that’s the kind of love song I don’t hear anymore. And why is one kind of arrested development preferable to another? I’ll take sweetness over bluster anyday, but that may be just wishful thinking. In general I would say I prefer experience over innocence (though in Blakean terms these are not stages of development), but I would not want to mistake drunken loutishness for maturity either.
I’m with you, BigSteve. I don’t see how Bon Scott’s personal self-destruction was reflected in any sort of MANly way in his music. The guy needed serious rehab. Hank Williams was a personal mess too, but his music was concerned with facing adult themes, like a MAN.
Remember folks, my questions regarding the value of Bon Scott were founded on musical issues. I have found nothing to contradict my belief that his lyrics sucked, and I’m still not convinced he was anything but a “comitted” singer. I asked if he was good. Someone around here must have a sense of pitch. He doesn’t sound to me like he’s on pitch that often, and as someone who does have a good sense of rhythm, I feel confident in stating that his vocals aren’t very rhythmic. His phrasing is awkward and lacking in swing.
Let’s stick to the main questions, and I commend all of you for staying away from bringing that other guy into the discussion. Nice work despite my constant prodding!
Mr. Mod said:
He doesn’t sound to me like he’s on pitch that often, and as someone who does have a good sense of rhythm, I feel confident in stating that his vocals aren’t very rhythmic.
Who are you — Randy Freaking Jackson? I’m giving you another friendly warning that you’ve been wearing that lab coat for too long. If you don’t change into something a bit less constricting soon, we’re going to have to take it off you by force. It’s clearly cutting off the blood supply to your brain.
I think the whole idea that you can “sing” these songs and make them better is nuts. Concern about pitch, melody or nuanced lyrical musings are not part of Scotts’ resume as ACDC frontman. His vocals are conceived as raspings. Leaving aside WHO was singing it, that’s what ultimately made that Celine Dion thing displayed a while back ill conceived from the start.
You’ve got a guy in a schoolboy outfit looking kinda effete on stage, yet playing very manly guitar, so it becomes natural to have a stereotypically macho dude growling with the force of a frightened kitten in front of that to balance the adolescent false imagery therefore confusing and compelling the audience at the same time.
Let me add: there are more than a few AC/DC band biographers who say that Bon was about to be eased out of the band for all the “shortcomings” Mr. Mod cites, when he conveniently died. Thanks to folks like *you*, Mr. Mod, we ended up with
Brian Johnson. Not that I want to get into the whole Johnson/Scott thing0. Just take note of the company you’re keeping.Hank Williams may have wrote about “adult” topics, but he also came up with “Hey good lookin’ what you got cookin’?” Similarly, Bon Scott may have laced his lyrics with juvelile jokes, but his worldview, as befiiting someone who basically spent his life in rock bands trying to make enough to get by, I find rather similar to the “adult” feelings of The Band’s Last Waltz.
I guess I’d classify Bon Scott as a guy who technically doesn’t fit the requirements of “rock expertise” But, then again, neither does Neil Young’s guitar playing, which I also dig.
Dr. Severin… sorry, Dr. John: We reach!
Answer the question!
You want to know whether Bon Scott had a sense of rhythm and was able to carry a tune? Okay, get ready for the deep, insightful analysis you crave. Are you ready?
Seriously, are you ready? ‘Cause this is going to BLOW YOUR FUCKING MIND!!!!
My answer to your questions is…
No, seriously, are you sure you want to know? I mean, *really sure*? ‘Cause I’ll spill the beans, you know. I’ll *tell* you whether I think Bon Scott could carry a tune. And I’ll *tell* you whether I thought he could carry a tune. I swear I will. Oh, yeah, I’ll tell you. *Then* you’ll see.
Don’t think I won’t tell you!!!!
Okay, seriously, now… can you handle the 500 megaton blast of Rock Insight that I’m about to drop on the epicenter of your mind? I’m not sure you can. I’m not sure you’re *ready* for it, mannnn. Seriously. I mean, do *you* think you can handle it?
Come on, man. Seriously, do you think you can handle it? I’M ASKING YOU A FREAKING QUESTION. CAN YOU HANDLE IT???
‘Cause I’ve got the answers you’re looking for, Jim. I’ve got ’em right here. Oh, yeah. I’ll *tell* you about Bon’s sense of rhythm. And I’ll *tell* you about whether or not he could carry a tune. Don’t think I won’t! ‘Cause I will! Just see if I don’t!
So… are you ready?
Okay, Bon Scott is good. He had a distinct voice that set AC/DC apart from their hard rock brethren. He had a cool way, vocally, of bending notes that accompanied Angus Young’s pentatonic riffs. He was an imposing frontman and gave the band their swagger and menace–things which earned AC/DC the coveted title of music your parents will hate.
There, I said it.
Keep stalling, hrrundivbakshi.
Bon had an unpleasant kind of sound to his voice but he was distinctive. He was lucky to be in that band because he seemed to me to be the least “pro like”. I watch Family jewels and he does not carry himself on stage like other front men of that era. He had a funny shapped skinny body and cheap clothes. At that time, late 70’s, many classic guys were around (Bowie, Paul Rogers, Ian Hunter, Springsteen, Jagger, Daultry etc.) As frontmen, these guys blow Bon away in terms of being classic and professional and talented. But none of these guys got to sing over such ballsy stripped down visceral blood boiling in the pocket basic and Catchy songs. My absolute favorite Bon moment is when he yells “High Voltage” and it sounds like Voltaj (it’s hard to spell out the way he makes it sound). That one yell gets the eternal thumbs up from me. Also, if anyone offers to make the Head sound even remotely related to ACDC in terms of dryness and punch and power and CLARITY and directness, than I’ll be there no matter what my wife says!
Mr. Mod said:
Keep stalling, hrrundivbakshi.
I say:
Oh, sorry. I thought I’d answered your questions. The answer to both questions is of course “yes.”
Sethro said:
Also, if anyone offers to make the Head sound even remotely related to ACDC in terms of dryness and punch and power and CLARITY and directness, than I’ll be there no matter what my wife says!
I say:
Seth, believe it or not, I’ve been on a quest for *years* to reverse engineer that amazing early Vanda/Young AC/DC sound. You won’t hear it on any of my, uh, “solo” stuff, ’cause it just didn’t seem to fit. But I’ve got the critical theory *down* on the guitars. No fooling. As far as the drums go… well, that’s a code pattern I’m still deciphering. I almost bought some Sonor drums a while back, just ’cause I love that Phil Rudd sound so much! (By the way, I really think Phil is the secret agent man in that band. Think about it!)
So, yes, I’m very serious about the Nixon’s Head “V-Y” project. But you’ll have to convince The Invisible Hand to sit one out to make it happen!
I smell a lab coat.
Touche, BigSteve!
Hey, Mr. Mod — seriously, you may want to check these out for more depth on Bon and his capabilities. You’ll find many instances of his tunefulness here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaHF-8eYxBc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYtjaVR6tiI
I know this topic has been beat to death but I have to add one quick comment. I always loved Bon and not until the band was recording a Bon era cover, did I REALLY start to appreciate it what he brought to AC/DC.
His energy totally sells the songs.
Rockbottomrob wrote:
In part, that’s what we’re here for. No need to apologize!
Bon Scott was an original and an authentic presence in that band. I hope to better appreciate his contributions next time I crank that stuff.
“I’ve been on a quest for *years* to reverse engineer that amazing early Vanda/Young AC/DC sound. You won’t hear it on any of my, uh, “solo” stuff, ’cause it just didn’t seem to fit. But I’ve got the critical theory *down* on the guitars. No fooling. As far as the drums go… well, that’s a code pattern I’m still deciphering.”
As someone who’s in the midst of putting the finishing touches on a reverse engineered AC/DC track, I’d be interested to hear what your theories are.
h.