Jun 092009
As right as it is wrong, all the thrills and spills of a working-class, R&B-based musician dropping acid!
Do you prefer Eric Burdon pre- or post-“turning on?”
As right as it is wrong, all the thrills and spills of a working-class, R&B-based musician dropping acid!
Do you prefer Eric Burdon pre- or post-“turning on?”
Whoops, posting is now enabled! Hrrundi wrote me offlist with the following pertinent question:
I believe the answer is NO!
Pre-turn on. Definitely pre-turn on.
As much as I love early Animals, I’m a post-turn on guy myself. I love the combination of looser musical arrangements, earnestness, and unintentional humor of songs like this one, “Sky Pilot,” “When I Was Young,” and “River Deep, Mountain High.”
Acid was the worst thing to happen to Rock & Roll in the 60s. The combination of generational hubris & psychedelics turned what were once a load of attitudinal punks who thought they knew everything, into a bunch of attitudinal punks who thought they knew ‘EVERYTHING’ (in the cosmic sense), because they were now, in fact, God. The one thing it made them forget was how to really rock. “Looser arrangements” & “unintentional humor” are all well & good, but I prefer something in my rock & roll that’s good for more than laughing at. At best, most of that stuff is ‘quaint’. At it’s worst, it’s pretentious, self-important nonsense. Gimme my rockers on booze & speed any day, over a bunch of Marshmallow Overcoat-clad Peanut Butter Conspiracists. Feh.
Bittman: We REACH!
more than once after bobbybittman’s shrill emergence in RTH, I thought that maybe he was an hvb clone. the above posts do nothing to quell my suspicions.
All that hilarious pre-Nancy reagan anti – drug literature aimed at school-aged kids in the 1970s makes the paisley-clad, tripped out druggie who “thinks he can fly” (and who, btw, is always fronting a band) seem like a total moron with terrible judgement, no social skills, no friends (except for drug friends), and low self-esteem to go with his terrible taste in clothes.
In my cynical youth, I figured that those pamphlets, film strips, and posters weren’t as driven by genuine concern for whether or not my generation would get into drugs as they were a desire to satirize stinky, proselytizing hippies.
as hrrundivbittman gleans from this clip: satirizing them doesn’t take much work.
though i like what the mod’s hearing in the post-turn on stuff, i’m pre-turn on.
I wish I’d packed some Turned-On Burdon (TOB) with me today for sharing. Let me get my work day underway after a serious rain delay on the way in, and then I’ll make some time to EXPAND on this subject. Most likely, as I think about this, my love for TOB will tie into my usual preference for artists opening themselves up and, with best intentions, reaching a beyond their means. Apart from artistic endeavors, I like when people do this in any facet of their lives.
Slight tangent… lo-fi funk wunderkind Cody ChesnuTT has a song called “Eric Burdon.” Cody is like Prince by way of Bob Pollard. Good stuff.
Gee, thanks Saturn. Nice to hear from you again, too. I’ve missed your 16-ton-weight-sheathed-in-velvet (or is it sandpaper?) criticisms of me, really I have. Mod, I already KNOW what post-turn on E.B. & The Animals sounds like, so whatever goofy little sugar cubes you dig up, I’m pretty sure I’ll still rather listen to ‘Outside, Looking In’, than whatever good-vibey grooviness E.B. dishes out in his “opened up”, hallucinatory revelry. Actually, I question whether that can really be called “opening up”, as it seems more like an invitation to watch the artists in question publicly masturbate. Thanks for “sharing”, Eric, but I just remembered I have to re-grout the tub tonight.
Oh, and personally, I used to be a big fan of psychedelics. I’m just not a fan of hippies & their smug, self-important ramblings.
Pre turn on for sure. Those post turn on songs were pretty awesome when I was more interested in that myself, but when the fog lifted the unintentional humor made the songs sound smug to me. I can’t listen to San Franciscan Nights at all, but there was a time I thought it was quite profound.
Good for you, Bobby (ie, already KNOWing what Burdon’s later output sounds like). Why the bad attitude? We missed you around here. It was fun seeing you post again, and now you’re getting all crankypants on me, poor Eric, and his Burdon. Come on, brother, we include Indians too.
Sorry Mod, I didn’t mean it to be a crankypants. I guess it’s just being described as “shrill” right outta the gate that annoyed me, but I it seems that’s Saturn & my fate; to perpetually wind each other up. I’ve got no beef with anything or anybody here, though. My point remains concerning the acid-head version of Rock & Roll; I see it less as “opening up”, & more as “jerking off”. Gotta go, but I’ll be back later.
I’m firmly entrenched in the middle of the ditch on this one. I can’t say that I’m a big enough Burdon fan to call it, but I actually like the latter period stuff that I’ve heard (Twain). But, those early singles are pretty classic. I don’t like it as much as I like The Who or The Beatles, but it’s not terrible. Plus, I have an appreciation of those wacky later records.
TB
bobby, forgive me.
i’m yankin’ your chain. you come off as if you can take such ribbings, which I like.
don’t go changin’! really!
Sat, your most assholish Bittman put-down was suggesting he might be me. Why you gotta kick Bittman in the nuts like that?
Perhaps I’m stating the obvious, but if you get rid of acid/acid culture, then you’re giving up Hendrix and Beatles, from Rubber Soul onwards.
Obvious yet important comment, Dr. John. Specific to this thread, what I was trying to get at is an admittedly snobbish sense I have of the role of psychedics in rock ‘n roll. In the hands of a relative “intellectually” and/or “spiritually” based artist, psychedelics could open the doors to fluid, seamless creations of the type you mention, Dr. John, and even arguably lesser flights of fancy, like, say, the best Doors songs. At its worst, the combination of drugs, rock ‘n roll, and self-proclaimed spirituality would result in something like Yes, which still makes sense of drug-taking, hippie idealism.
In the mind of a down-and-dirty, working class, R&B-based artist like Burdon, however, I would argue that the drugs could have some unintended effects, which still led to some cool music but also led to the kind of B-movie nightmare scenarios for which hippies would be mocked to this day. In the best of unintended circumstances, as I would argue is the case with Eric Burdon, a guy suffering from a severe case of Fogerty Syndrome (https://www.rocktownhall.com/blogs/index.php/2007/08/20/john_fogerty_syndrome), a twisted idealism tinged with cynicism can result that I find enjoyable and more open to repeated listens than I find the airtight productions of early Animals songs. Those early singles are fantastic in their own way, but you hear them a few times and you’ve heard them for eternity. They play right into Burdon’s rigid, manly approach – and it’s a great mix. A few years later, however, as the material and production began to stray from the formula, Burdon and whatever band he’d assembled can pull out some surprises. Taken to its extreme, with his transformation into an actual black man and the leader of early War, Burdon is full of surprises and occasionally delivers a richer – if sometimes silly – mix of music.
Anyhow, that’s more than enough for anyone to chew, and I apologize for having aired out my snobbish views on a guy who for all I know may be as intellectually and spiritually sound as anyone in rock.
hvb:
i thought about pointing that out! but then i decided i’d leave that little nugget to you….i mean him. i mean you (pl).
Wait a sec, Mod: the Doors have good songs?
They need to release some of those post-haste!
I keed. Actually, I have recently begun to be able to look past the silliness of the Doors to be able to enjoy them as a nifty little psych/blues/jazz combo. Jim Morrison still seems unintentionally hilarious, though.
sourbob, that’s EXACTLY the conclusion I came to over the years!
re. the doors as psych / blues / jazz: how do you two feel about the backing music on “An American Prayer?”
Speaking of the pre-psych Animals, doesn’t House of the Rising Sun fall into the category of records you never want to hear ever again? Like, I mean, never? It wasn’t that great to start with.
Me, I would like to know what Jimi would have come up with sans psychedelics. Personally, I found a recent listen to The Experience-era box set, with it’s trippy mixes,& little sonic doo-dads coming at me from every which way, to be a distracting annoyance which took me OUT of the music, rather than immersing me in some brave new acid-head sonic paradise. I preferred listening to my old mono mix of Are You Experienced. It was more involving & less gimmicky sounding.
As far as The Fabs are concerned, my least favorite period is the one where acid played the biggest part in their ‘creative process’. Apart from 4 or 5 songs, most of that stuff comes off like the wanking I mentioned in my earlier post. Also, I don’t consider it to be from Rubber Soul to The End, just ‘Sgt. Pooper’s’, ‘M.M.T’., & a few bits on ‘The Beatles’ (like that colossal waste of time, Revolution #9)
The Doors were bores. 1st LP & L.A. Woman are the only ones I still own. Again, there may be a few other individual songs I like, but to tell you the truth, if I was never allowed to hear another Doors song in my life, it really wouldn’t bother me.
Also, I STILL like ‘House of the Rising Sun’. I like how E.B. sings it, I like the organ sound, & I especially like how Hilton Valentine plays those arpeggiated chords. I can’t say the same for ‘San Franciscan Nights’.
[blockquote]re. the doors as psych / blues / jazz: how do you two feel about the backing music on “An American Prayer?”[/blockquote]
Wow, Saturn, I dunno. That being one of the worst offenders in the Morrisonian hubris category, I haven’t spun it since I needed Clearasil. Is it worth another shot?
BigSteve, I’m with you on “House of the Rising Sun” being a song I never need to hear again. That’s about as airtight and forced a song/performance as the British Invasion produced. (And yes, I know it’s not a British Invasion composition – and you know what I mean.)
probably not, sourbob. there was just something in the phrase “psych / blues / jazz” that made me thnk of their playing on that album.
I would like to put my 2 cents in this matter & say that I prefer the pre-“turn-on” Eric Burdon, but by a narrow margin, as I do like the “turn-on” singles (I remember being scared hearing “Sky Pilot” when I was a lad of 5). I don’t really have any interest listening to “deep cuts” of “turn-on” Eric. To me, “turned-on” Eric Burdon reminds me a lot of Dick Shawn’s LSD character in The Producers.
Also, what’s w/the hating about “House of The Rising Sun.” Sure, we probably lstened to it a bit too much the past 40+ years or so, but it’s a great song & it made #1 in 1964, which was pretty amazing considering the subject matter, the sound & the length (4 minutes). A song like that could have not made #1 in the singles chart the year before.
I like Eric Burdon before Acid
I like Bobby Bitman after Acid
This is just a personal thing, but The Beatles never sounded “psychedelic” to my ears. There were hints of it on track like “I Am The Walrus” and “Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds”. (Hey! I just realized that they letters in the title of that song spell out “LSD”! Heavy, man…) Maybe it’s just my rock snobbery or a complete misunderstanding of the word. To me, psychedelic music is “jammy” and “trippy”. Hendrix invented it according to Michael Nesmith, which is good enough for me. I can definitely call “Sky Pilot” a psychedelic cut. The Doors certainly ventured into these waters on more than one occasion. Ditto for early Pink Floyd.
The Beatles were great, but they’ll never be accused of jamming. One of the things I admire about them is their ability to arrange a tune. I cannot say they never jammed, but it wasn’t one of their best known attributes. Like I said, perhaps I’m being a bit snobbish in my inability to lump my precious Beatles into those dirty hippy psych bands like The Dead or Turned-On Eric. I usually dislike “psychedelic music” so maybe I’m justifying my love for The Fabs.
They just don’t sound psychedelic to me, but I’m an idiot.
TB
OK, maybe I’m just sick of having “House of the Rising Sun” jammed down my throat – and maybe I tire easily of songs in that time signature, 6/8, I believe. The whole whorehouse/cumming of age aspect of the lyrics also got old for me when I was young.
Another song in 6/8 that that I know is pretty good yet I get sick of hearing is “When a Man Loves a Woman.” That big Procol Harum song is another overblown oldie – this coming from a guy who still enjoys hearing “Brown-Eyed Girl,” any Supremes song, and plenty of other oldies that drive some people nuts.
I actually love what the Mod is calling 6/8 time and what some rhythm programs call ‘triplet feel.’ I think what I hate is the “I just learned how to play the guitar and even I can play this” aspect of it. That and the way the whole thing is over-dramatized. Plus the way Eric sings “New Owleenz.” Also the dragged out ending with that final major chord pisses me off.
I don’t always hate that time signature, but yes, when played without the proper touch it sounds bad in a hurry! I figured you’d object to Burdon’s New Orleans posing, BigSteve. That’s your birthright.
I think saturn had a great point: that the “just say no” era led to a spate of rock revisionism concerning drugs.
First off, acid rock now becomes a derogatory term that denotes endless, mindless jamming, like the Dead (which I really like, btw). Or it pertains to a kind of childlike babble or nonsense (see Syd Barrett post acid casualty, Eric Burdon–love that reference to The Producers!)
But in reality, acid rock should, I think, cover any music whose experimentation is being guided by experiences on LSD or is making associations based on the desire to “open the doors of perception.”
Thus, The Beatles’ Revolver is one of the best examples of acid rock, most of which is concise pop songs, studio experimentation–and no jamming.
“She Said” was inspired by a comment Peter Fonda made while he was tripping. “I’m Only Sleeping” and “Tomorrow Never Knows” sure sound like an attempt to musically describe a trip.
I don’t want to be accused of relying on backstory: I don’t have any proof of what drugs the Beatles were on in the studio. But historical context seems to suggest that LSD had a significant role in the creative process, and to overlook this fact, I would argue, reduces the value of the Beatles’ cultural groundbreaking.
The Beatles were introduced to pot (by Bob Dylan) in August 1964, and to LSD in April 1965. So their ‘drug-influenced’ music goes back a lot farther than people think.
and speed in 61/62.
I’m coming too late to the plate on a topic I really enjoy.
Pre-turn on Burdon, much more enjoyable. And of course that’s not because I hate psychedelic music in any general way, obviously. With all their blundering, the Animals are still essential rock and roll to me. I’m wondering though without much forethought here whether they’re the original blooze band–I mean, in a way that award obviously should go to the Stones, except that early Stones is sort of a rock and roll blues light, whereas blooze, as I would understand it, needs to make the blues heavier.
Still, the post turn-on psychedelic Burdon is really fun in some lost in time kinda way. And isn’t it “ordinary guy psychedelia” (a contradiction in terms, I know) in a way that’s both funny and appealing? Somehow Burdon is just talentless/talented enough to sound goofily down to earth even when he’s flying.
Burdon was probably the most credible British R&B singer of his era, purely in terms of his vocal cords. And it’s that voice that I think keeps even the hippy-dippiest later stuff from drifting off into fluff.
The song Monterrey absolutely should not work. Describe it and it sounds like it would be a total joke, but I always enjoy hearing it on the radio. When I Was Young teeters on the edge with the faux Indian violin riff, but Burdon’s singing in the middle eight (“When I was young it was maaawww important…”) really saves it.
I’m not saying the New Animals made good albums, but even The Best of the Animals LP, which was a record owned by virtually EVERYONE I knew when I was a teenager, has lots of filler. The good songs are really good, but it’s a bad sign when your greatest hits record has some crappy material on it.
Steve, I was thinking about just this issue recently–that some bands have a 10-14 song Greatest Hits after making 6-8 or even more full length albums, and in fact even the Greatest Hits has only about 4 or 5 songs worth listening to.
Bands that can’t even fill a greatest hits record is something I’d like to hear more about.