Feb 112011
This is not quite a Last Man Standing topic, but it may verge on one. In the glamorous, hedonistic world of rock ‘n roll it’s rare that fans actually consider a favorite artist’s sobriety a plus. Steve Earle‘s sobriety recently came up in discussion, and he seems to be one artist that even longtime fans would agree has benefitted—artistically speaking—from cleaning up his life. I mean, hardcore Earle fans would agree that his talents have at least been maintained through sobriety if not deepened, right?
Leaving the obvious personal health benefits of any rock artists’ sobriety aside, which artists come to mind as having grown artistically, at least initially, by getting his or her life together?
Bowie-Berlin
Nick Cave.
Aerosmith (at least the first couple of giant hit albums that followed their group 12-step program).
Strongly disagree.
I thought they turned out about 3 or 4 worthwhile songs during their heyday. They put out at least that many during their sober years. I disagree with YOU!
Tom Waits is the only other one that comes to mind, although I’ll take Oats’ word on Nick Cave.
But ss Pump really better than Toys In the Attic?
Is Low really better than Ziggy?
John Hiatt.
When Mr. Mod said “benefitted — artistically speaking,” I took that to mean that they did not necessarily make better work when they sobered up, but conquering their addictions also enabled them to take their careers and/or art to a new place.
So sober Bowie makes Low which is a sonic and artistic achievement on its own, regardless of whether its better or worse than other famous DB albums. Sober Nick Cave has gained more fans with Grinderman/Dig Lazarus Dig. Even a committed Aerosmith hater such as myself can recognize that their ability in the mid’-’80s to reinvent themselves as an MTV hard rock band that appealed to fickle teenagers was kinda impressive.
Strongly disagree as well. ROCKS is their masterpiece with Toys in the attic as a second. Pump is about 5th and the other sober records are not even top 10. Check out live bootleg. They are a mess but the show is amazing
Granted, cdm, you’re tangling with a guy who never found much use for his copy of Toys in the Attic. The worthwhile Wasted Aerosmith songs that come to mind for me are as follows:
WORTHWHILE RECORDINGS FROM WASTED ERA
Dream On – pretty much flawless, if overplayed
Sweet Emotion – tremendous intro and cool verses, but it could lose a 90 seconds toward the end; the intro sets the bar too high
Walk This Way – pretty much flawless, although I wish the playing and production were as crisp as the good songs on those sobriety albums
Come Together – one of the only listenable songs from that Sgt. Pepper’s turd of a movie and, for a few measures, nearly better than the Beatles’ original
Their cover of Walkin’ the Dog was good, if memory serves, but Foghat could make that song work. Same goes for Train Kept-a-Rollin’.
SONGS NOT-QUITE “WORTHWHILE”
Back in the Saddle suffers from the same problem as Sweet Emotion – too much buiild-up in the intro that the rest of the song can’t live up to. In this case the song and the playing mostly blow, so it doesn’t make my “worthwhile” list from this period.
Sick as a Dog – again, it’s a lot of hyped-up nonsense with no groove, no real point. Works best as a handbook for the formation of Guns ‘n Roses.
Now, let’s examine the worthwhile songs from the band’s sober years:
Dude (Looks Like a Lady)
Angel
Love in an Elevator
Janie’s Got a Gun
Cryin’
Crazy
I’m probably missing a few, because some songs I like by them I’ve only heard in videos and don’t know the song title. I do know that I HATE “Rag Doll” and considered disliking Aerosmith more than I ever did previously when I first head it.
Yes, he made ONE album that I liked after getting sober, Bring the Family. Then I quickly went back to finding his voice unbearable, but I’ll buy that one.
Oats, thanks for clarifying what I indeed meant – and thanks for your support of the value of sober Aerosmith.
MUCH better, if you ask me.
And your case for sober Bowie is a good one. I don’t know that he’d ever fallen, but that trilogy of sober albums is artistically solid and new.
Nick Lowe – not “better” than his best album (the second one), but MUCH better than the crap he’d been turning out leading up to his sober, on more than chemical levels, period.
No more no more
Back in the saddle
Last child
Mama kin
No surprise
Home sweet home
Adams apple
Uncle salty
From the sober years
Hangmans jury
The other side
What it takes
Let the music do the talkin
Elevator
Monkey on my back
Fine
Jaded
I think the 70s stuff is just kicks ass which is what i am looking for out of the Toxic Twins
Jaded – I think that’s another one I like from that period.
yeah NO WAY is sober Aerosmith even close to their first 4 and a half albums. Rocks destroys all comers. Last Child and Nobody’s Fault. so good.
Low, Heroes, and Lodger are NOT netter than Ziggy, Hunky, or TMWSTW, but they ARE better than Station to Station, Young Americans, Diamond Dogs & Pin Ups all of which are too Cokey.
Tyler/Perry clearly scored solid hits on your Kokomo Bone with those, Mod.
The only two post-recovery Aerosmith songs I don’t run from are ‘Livin’ On The Edge” and the one that (probably accidentally) seemed lifted from Maybe I’m Amazed…which, I actually had to go look that one up for the name: “What It Takes”. I remember being so anti-Aerosmith at the time that I didn’t like it then, but have since made an honest reassessment of it, and that’s actually a solid winner for them.
Jungleland mentions “Jaded”, and that came along when I really couldn’t stand Tyler (a period that I’m still in), but I could perhaps see myself, in another 15 years, finding it in me to give that one another shot. Maybe.
Ragdoll they should have sold to Leon Redbone. He could have had a hit with that.
I believe The Blue Mask was Lou Reed’s first post-sobriety album. I think that qualifies as “having grown artistically, at least initially,” though taken as a whole his pre-sobriety work is better than what came after obviously.
Correct – and agreed on all counts, although his next album is sure to be the one that sounds the way his music was meant to be heard…
Not trying to turn this into a “50 favorite Aerosmith song” thread, but: how could both of your forget the awesome, Aerosmith-defining “Lick and A Promise” from “Rocks”?! That’s not just one of my fave Aerosmith songs — it’s a fave song, period.
Any joke made at the expense of Leon Redbone is funny!
yes! (great song!)
Are we looking for artisits that were at their best sober or just beter than they were right before they got sober? Usually they start off f*ed up and good, then fall apart, THEN get sober and either grow or turn to slick crap that tries too hard.
Sobriety was good for Eric Clapton, but nobody would say his best music was written when he was sober, just that his WORST music was written right before he got sober. Same with Elton John? Others??
We’re looking for artists who experienced at least a burst of creative growth following sobriety. Clapton definitely seems to be the better human being, but it’s hard to say he’s made any good music since the early ’70s beside that song about his kid who died, “Tears in Heaven.” (Say what you will about EC and that song, I don’t think it was half bad and it was fully heartfelt.) Same goes for Elton John: better human being, but no signs of musical growth, unless his new album with Leon Russell is half as good as it’s intentions and Elton kicks into a new creative gear from this point forward.
Fav Year – 1965. A little-less self conscious than 1966 but it has all of my favorite music in high gear. 1st and 2nd brittish invasion, Motown, soul music, and garage.
Fav Areosmith song – “Mama Kin” Hand Down
Ooops – replied to wrong thread. I’ll move it there.
I think Warren Zevon’s first post-sobriety album Sentimental Hygiene showed some artistic growth. The one after that not so much.
Can we agree that “Rocks” is the best Aerosmith album? Still listen to it — nothin else, well maybe Toys in the Attic once in awhile.
Good call — Sentimental Hygiene is a really good album and has that fantastic rehab song on it. “I was raking leaves with Liza — helping Liz clean up the yard.” Detox Mansion!
Without saying “You’re wrong,” I have to just say, “You’re wrong.” Sorry, there’s just no other way to put it! Rocks is Aerosmith’s pinnacle achievement, but in retrospect I have to admit that the albums that came before it are all strong. Everything afterwards is dreck. When they got sober, the dreck turned to shit.
Was Bowie really sober then? I seem to remember him saying he doesn’t even remember the tour that the album Stage came from (1978). That was the first tour I saw Bowie on, and easily the best, but I thought he said he didn’t even remember what songs he played.
Funoka, I actually have to admit to playing all of the albums up through Rocks these days. Not a lot, but I grudgingly have to admit they’re pretty damned good.
Lick and a Promise is a killer!
Is it really possible to be too cokey?
Robert Pollard. Oops, I don’t think there’s been a sober period. My bad.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPRamRJnr_A
Bravo!
Beautiful, Kilroy!